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in response to Ocram: M.H. Just seperating the facts from the fluff. Honesty and transparency for all to see, even if some of you do not like it.
in response to Ocram:
M.H.
Just seperating the facts from the fluff.
Honesty and transparency for all to see, even if some of you do not like it.
Oc - Is that what you're doing? I don't think you're qualified. If you think you are, post your verifiable credentials please.
in response to Ocram: Marco Defender, From Lazy and stubborn but persistant: Two weeks ago I asked about the teacher's hired. You did not say then that they were NOT hired. You insisted that I and others come into the store front to get the information. You could have answered my question, honestly, then. Why the charade? So you do not have the 9 positions filled as of yet but Jane's article and presentation last month said that there were 60 teacher's who applied for 9 positions. Saying that to a crowd was just an example of not really telling all of the facts just those that would make people believe something that it was not. She could have said then, that the positions were NOT filled, but left that to the imagination of the crowd. Could these teachers chosen not be certified? Could they not have the necessary experience to teach high school, never mind advanced placement classes. Still you have not answered those vital questions and once again, beat around the bush. How can you or Jane be so sure that what you will be offering will be "state of the art" or "world class" if you do not have the staff lined up? You do not have a place to call home, you do not even have the grants for funding to pay for your hoped for promises. Yes, you will say anything that is possible, make people think that they are getting something, when you know for yourself that the glass is "maybe" half full. I have "read up" up on the things people are attempting to do. Very nice that they have spent so much time committed to an experiment that has not been, even remotely, fulfilled as of yet. The problem is parents who send their kids to the Academy should be aware that they are part of an experiment, which has little to no basis in fact, except for promises and cloaked answers to questions.
Marco Defender,
From Lazy and stubborn but persistant:
Two weeks ago I asked about the teacher's hired. You did not say then that they were NOT hired. You insisted that I and others come into the store front to get the information. You could have answered my question, honestly, then. Why the charade?
So you do not have the 9 positions filled as of yet but Jane's article and presentation last month said that there were 60 teacher's who applied for 9 positions. Saying that to a crowd was just an example of not really telling all of the facts just those that would make people believe something that it was not. She could have said then, that the positions were NOT filled, but left that to the imagination of the crowd. Could these teachers chosen not be certified? Could they not have the necessary experience to teach high school, never mind advanced placement classes. Still you have not answered those vital questions and once again, beat around the bush.
How can you or Jane be so sure that what you will be offering will be "state of the art" or "world class" if you do not have the staff lined up? You do not have a place to call home, you do not even have the grants for funding to pay for your hoped for promises.
Yes, you will say anything that is possible, make people think that they are getting something, when you know for yourself that the glass is "maybe" half full.
I have "read up" up on the things people are attempting to do. Very nice that they have spent so much time committed to an experiment that has not been, even remotely, fulfilled as of yet.
The problem is parents who send their kids to the Academy should be aware that they are part of an experiment, which has little to no basis in fact, except for promises and cloaked answers to questions.
Oc - Wow, everything is a conspiracy with you. You fantasize far too deviously and go in a direction of deception that never even crosses the minds of the smart and dedicated people at the MIA school. Time to up the meds.
The info on the teachers is new to me as of yesterday, which is why you hadn't read it before. Another conspiracy to keep PUBLIC information from you and the rest of the public. What to do?
By definition, a charter school is an experimental school. You refer to it negatively, but that just proves how lacking you are when it comes to how well this was conceived and how well it will progress once it's up and running. You want some proof, look within, at the Charter Middle School. They are the only middle school in Collier County to make AYP. Oh yeah, it's a charter school. NONE of the regular public middle schools made it in the entire school district here. Looks to me like the experiment is working. By the way, those MICMS kids will be going to MIAHS. What kind of performance do you think they be bringing with them and putting on the scoreboard?! If that's not proof, I don't know what you expect.
I speak the truth, not "anything possible". All my information posted is verifiable. Posting anything else here is just counter productive to the importance and value of this program, so I won't let my "interested parent comments" veer from fact and truth. The few remaining oppo's would have a field day if I did.
Why don't you get on board this excellent program and be part of the solution and something great for the kids on this island. If you CHOOSE not to, please do us a favor and keep you conspiracy theories to yourself. You're not adding value, and really, that's what we need. I know it's too much to ask, but I must ask silly questions at times. I wonder where I learned such a silly skill? Thanks Oc.
in response to 33yearresident: MarcoDefender - MIA wouldn't make something up??? HELLO! Where have you been???
in response to 33yearresident:
MarcoDefender - MIA wouldn't make something up??? HELLO! Where have you been???
33 - Easy to point fingers. Go get the facts yourself, definitely don't take it at face value.
How do you people get by in life without checking your own facts?! C'mon, do your homework.
Challenge them if you must, but don't sit back and just rattle complaints. Earn it! You don't seem like those "entitled" folks who want it all with no effort or work of their own. Get to work, get the right education for yourself.
in response to Ocram: “The first year, the maximum number of students accepted into the school is 250.”What is the minimum number needed in order to fulfil State requirements in September? “The Academy is a public school that is open free to all students in the district.”Why are parents asked to donate funds or time if it is free? “There are many costs associated with the start-up of the school.”What happened to those “grants’’ that the Academy was almost sure of getting and will definitely need in order to fulfil acedemic promises already made? “Over the past two years, the academy has made many changes, but the mission has remained the same.”Does this mean that promises made can not be accomplished? “The academy is committed to offering your child a choice for a world-class public education.”Committed to offering is different that previous claims of actually getting a “World Class” education. Wouldn’t you say? “The school will feature a small-school atmosphere with individualized attention and hands-on learning opportunities for your child.”Why is that better than a regular school atmosphere with all the amenities available for a complete education? “Above all, we will put your child's needs above all others in order to ensure his or her success.”What does this mean? What does above all others mean. Who are those others that do not get the great treatment? “The academy has set high expectations for our students and our staff. We will strive to help your child reach his or her fullest potential and will not settle for anything less.”Setting high expectations and merely striving is quite different than actually achieving them. Please post the credentials and experience of the teachers under STAFF on your website as you did for the Principal and Coach, or do you still consider that not important enough for potential interested folks to know about? You can not get away from full transparency.
“The first year, the maximum number of students accepted into the school is 250.”What is the minimum number needed in order to fulfil State requirements in September?
“The Academy is a public school that is open free to all students in the district.”Why are parents asked to donate funds or time if it is free?
“There are many costs associated with the start-up of the school.”What happened to those “grants’’ that the Academy was almost sure of getting and will definitely need in order to fulfil acedemic promises already made?
“Over the past two years, the academy has made many changes, but the mission has remained the same.”Does this mean that promises made can not be accomplished?
“The academy is committed to offering your child a choice for a world-class public education.”Committed to offering is different that previous claims of actually getting a “World Class” education. Wouldn’t you say?
“The school will feature a small-school atmosphere with individualized attention and hands-on learning opportunities for your child.”Why is that better than a regular school atmosphere with all the amenities available for a complete education?
“Above all, we will put your child's needs above all others in order to ensure his or her success.”What does this mean? What does above all others mean. Who are those others that do not get the great treatment?
“The academy has set high expectations for our students and our staff. We will strive to help your child reach his or her fullest potential and will not settle for anything less.”Setting high expectations and merely striving is quite different than actually achieving them.
Please post the credentials and experience of the teachers under STAFF on your website as you did for the Principal and Coach, or do you still consider that not important enough for potential interested folks to know about? You can not get away from full transparency.
Oc - Your lazy and stubborn ways continue. Well, I did my homework once again, where you wouldn't. To finally address your question, the reason those others aren't posted under staff is because they have not been hired yet. From what I was told, those teachers received letters of intent to be hired. I don't know why, but that's the answer. I personally think it's because they are working with the school district on their school contract, which is not yet done but that's just my opinion. I know you won't like it (big surprise), but there's your answer.
On your other news questions, their charter application says minimum is 62 students, so they are not far off now.
Donations are important because state law does not allow tax funds to be used to pay for the building or land for a charter school. Those have to be paid for privately. This is good for taxpayers like you...and me.
Grants take a long time, at least that's what a friend told me. She works in the grant department for a county community college, so that's reliable information. With budget cuts everywhere, they are also apparently harder to get now than in the democrat hey day past.
The rest of your questions are theme based. The research shows that there are many differentiating factors to a high performance, quality education. A small class size, intimate support from peers and instructors and a hands on approach are part of that solution.
This group is really doing some great things. You might try and read up a little bit and educate yourself on the details.
in response to freedomofspeech1: Nearly fifty...i.e. about 30.....hardly on their way....dont expect many more enrollments. Most if not all of the kids at MICMS have already enrolled at LELY!
in response to freedomofspeech1:
Nearly fifty...i.e. about 30.....hardly on their way....dont expect many more enrollments. Most if not all of the kids at MICMS have already enrolled at LELY!
Freedom - I don't think the MIA leadership would make this up, knowing all their records are subject to public review under the sunshine law. Far too risky for you opponents to latch onto.
I agree with you, Lely will get a bunch, but so will MIA, which is supported by the figures already. Remember, it's just March, and most haven't taken the step to register yet. In consideration, I bet you will see another 100+ before the first day.
Sorry it's far better than you hoped.
Island I - I heard that only a few will need to be moved (not removed) as only the front part of their property will be used. It seems like the permit is completed, but I don't know if that is fact yet. I'm waiting to hear back.
Nearly 50 enrolled already. It looks like parents understand the value and differentiation that this program will bring.
As I read the last few exchanges it's starting to look like a comedy routine between the two most active bloggers. What are you, neighbors or cousins? You both need to work on your act a little, it's very predictable.
Personally, I don't think the HS people are focused on trying to impress you or run to fulfill your need for information. Surely they are fully aware that you will not choose to send you children or grand children to the HS. OK, so be it. We get it, there are some of you who don't get it. That's fine. Each of us can make a choice, Lely or MIA. But we all have a choice because of their efforts. As previously reported, there are already 30+ students enrolled, so obviously many are convinced this model and offering will suit their needs.
In consideration, there's no need to bash these people who are just trying to put a competitive and rewarding HS experience for kids on this island. From what I know they are all volunteers. No one gets paid for any of the work done to support the MIA. Try and show a little consideration for all their hard work to help Marco show more value and put up a strong showing on student performance and academics.
I seriously don't understand some of you. How does bringing them down, pump you up?
in response to 20_Days: I have been reading the blogs (recent and past) and as a parent, am also concerned that it has been requested that the credentials be listed forthe new staff to only be ignored by the MIA. They say to come in to the storefront--well, that really does not tell you anything - just continues the "world class" promise without thespecifics to back it up. There seems to be a lot of talk, but no substance. One proponant on the blog said that any discussion of this topic is moot! How can a discussion of relevant information to parents be moot? What exactly is is it that the MIA does not want us to know?
in response to 20_Days:
I have been reading the blogs (recent and past) and as a parent, am also concerned that it has been requested that the credentials be listed forthe new staff to only be ignored by the MIA. They say to come in to the storefront--well, that really does not tell you anything - just continues the "world class" promise without thespecifics to back it up. There seems to be a lot of talk, but no substance. One proponant on the blog said that any discussion of this topic is moot! How can a discussion of relevant information to parents be moot? What exactly is is it that the MIA does not want us to know?
Pilar - Accuracy is very important. Ocram's view is moot, not the information.
As mentioned, information on the hired people for the HS is public record. Call and ask for the information. I don't believe it's the MIA people's responsibility to post information in response to a blog request. There's a right and accepted method to get this information, just because it's not posted here, it doesn't mean it's not important or a neglected action. If you want to know, the information is available to you. But, as with all good things, you need to put a forth a little effort.
in response to Ocram: Marco Defender, The audacity of your statement "The truth is often unforgiving" when requests for honest informational postings are ignored by the proponents. People who disagree with you, when they feel their world is being threatened and you need to approach their interpretation with a legal threat, to "attempt" to prove you are correct, while you are calling them "idiots". (It may be a surprise to you but my attorney says that it appears that you are incorrect in your interpetation of the deed.) An earlier, quite internally informed of the workings of the Academy, proponent, obnoxiously uses the "I never, ever lose, ever!" statement. And you are asking what my feelings are about Tract K or what my button is? Quite honestly, well that button is people who twist the truth, no matter whom it may hurt, in order to get their way.
The audacity of your statement "The truth is often unforgiving" when requests for honest informational postings are ignored by the proponents.
People who disagree with you, when they feel their world is being threatened and you need to approach their interpretation with a legal threat, to "attempt" to prove you are correct, while you are calling them "idiots". (It may be a surprise to you but my attorney says that it appears that you are incorrect in your interpetation of the deed.)
An earlier, quite internally informed of the workings of the Academy, proponent, obnoxiously uses the "I never, ever lose, ever!" statement.
And you are asking what my feelings are about Tract K or what my button is?
Quite honestly, well that button is people who twist the truth, no matter whom it may hurt, in order to get their way.
Oc - Unfortunately, you need to show a little audacity around here to be an advocate for local resident students. I actually consider that a compliment. So a "thank you" is in order on my part. Really, thank you.
What a threat, to put a school on school district land. How crazy of me. What planet are you from? As someone else wrote previously, common sense doesn't appear to be all that common.
If you want information, it's all public record, so go do your homework. Your laziness doesn't constitute an issue on my part. I don't have the time to remediate your situation or ineptitude. I want you to see this great opportunity for what it is, as opposed to your odd conspiracy theory, but I think my energy with you has topped out. Your cup is full, and clearly there's no more space for my input and perspective on why this MIA HS program will be a positive for the island, the students and the community. You'll have to graduate to the understanding on your own, in due time, as I know you will...eventually.
There are always winners and losers in any situation. It's unfortunate, but I don't get to make those rules of life. I would like to see everyone win, but right now with Tract K, the students (children, mind you) have lost. What a shame. Let down by the supposed stewards of their educational interest, the Collier School Board. What a travesty. It's not like they wanted the land for some elite and undeserving private school or lame private pre-school or after-school / montessori program. It's for a public school HS, for all to benefit from.
The fact that you are favorable on that Tract K result is shameful on you. I hope you can live with that. What's the world coming to when people value animals more than human beings. Children no less, who don't have a voice or ability to fight for their rights from someone like you.
Yes, shameful fits you well. Good luck with that. With this subject, you've finally and officially rendered yourself moot.
in response to Ocram: C'mon Marco Defender you said earlier today the Tract K is out of the picture, why are you still refering to it as though it is NOT out of the picture above? Which is it? Why should the majority reconsider its long term gain? Maybe you should re-consider yours.
C'mon Marco Defender you said earlier today the Tract K is out of the picture, why are you still refering to it as though it is NOT out of the picture above? Which is it?
Why should the majority reconsider its long term gain? Maybe you should re-consider yours.
Oc - You brought up Tract K, so I commented on the subject. It's a done deal, yes. However, IMHO, the school board broke the law and I'm hopeful it will get rectified. So first one is fact, and second is my personal, wishful thinking.
Again, what's your interest in Tract K? It seems to be a button for you.
Also, I'm sorry to call those Tract K residents what they are, but the truth is often unforgiving. Many of those vocal residents flip flopped on the solar / school deal, so there's no respect to be had for that "special" group.
in response to Ocram: ISLAND DEFENDER WROTE: "So, you still didn't answer why you want it to fail. Seems you're more a part of the problem than the solution. If that's true, then let it go. If you think it won't do well, that's fine, so noted. No value being a hater. You say you would've supported the program at the Y, why a new opinion because the real estate has changed? This would indicate you have some special interest in Tract K. What is it? The location doesn't determine whether an organization will have an honest reputation, where are you coming from on this? Tract K was school land, it was the logical choice, why is it that people freak out about putting a school on school board land? It's simple and logical. People who own land adjacent to Tract K knew that was school board land when they bought. I have no sympathy for them if they are upset about putting a school on school board land. What kind of idiot couldn't see that coming? Anyway, Tract K is done with, so it's not important anymore. I'm over it, can you get over it?..... Now you are calling people idiots who live around Tract K. and do not want a High School on it! There are many things that could have been put on the land other than a High School. The deed specifically says "school district use" not specifically for a school. Let alone a High School with all the accoutrements that come with a high school. MarcoDefender, I love living on Marco and "Most" of the people who live here. I am sorry that you do not feel the same way. I fail to see, though, the purpose of the use of the word "hate" in yours or the "late" Klabautermann's blogs. It seems that anyone who disagrees with your point of view is now an idiot or a hater. Not very becoming of you, I would venture to say. I did not come here not knowing where I was going nor forced by reasons of circumstance. It appears by your comments that you failed to see and fully understand those, very important, considerations when moving somewhere. BTW the information I requested, teacher's credentials" should be available to all parents and one should not have to go out of their way to find it out. People did not have to go out of their way to hear about the principal, did they now? If the school is for a "great many people" well I feel that there are a "greater" many more people that prefer it not be on Marco. Show some verifiable numbers. You see I can not believe a word you say about Tract K being done with, afterall it was a major proponent, last June, that apparently said at a realtor's meeting that it was a "Done Deal" back then and little birdie makes me think that person could very possibly have been you or was it the proponent who posted the "I never, ever lose, ever" statement? Oh I forgot, you do not know who that was.
ISLAND DEFENDER WROTE:
"So, you still didn't answer why you want it to fail. Seems you're more a part of the problem than the solution. If that's true, then let it go. If you think it won't do well, that's fine, so noted. No value being a hater. You say you would've supported the program at the Y, why a new opinion because the real estate has changed? This would indicate you have some special interest in Tract K. What is it? The location doesn't determine whether an organization will have an honest reputation, where are you coming from on this?
Tract K was school land, it was the logical choice, why is it that people freak out about putting a school on school board land? It's simple and logical. People who own land adjacent to Tract K knew that was school board land when they bought. I have no sympathy for them if they are upset about putting a school on school board land. What kind of idiot couldn't see that coming? Anyway, Tract K is done with, so it's not important anymore. I'm over it, can you get over it?.....
Now you are calling people idiots who live around Tract K. and do not want a High School on it! There are many things that could have been put on the land other than a High School.
The deed specifically says "school district use" not specifically for a school. Let alone a High School with all the accoutrements that come with a high school.
MarcoDefender, I love living on Marco and "Most" of the people who live here. I am sorry that you do not feel the same way. I fail to see, though, the purpose of the use of the word "hate" in yours or the "late" Klabautermann's blogs. It seems that anyone who disagrees with your point of view is now an idiot or a hater. Not very becoming of you, I would venture to say.
I did not come here not knowing where I was going nor forced by reasons of circumstance. It appears by your comments that you failed to see and fully understand those, very important, considerations when moving somewhere.
BTW the information I requested, teacher's credentials" should be available to all parents and one should not have to go out of their way to find it out. People did not have to go out of their way to hear about the principal, did they now?
If the school is for a "great many people" well I feel that there are a "greater" many more people that prefer it not be on Marco. Show some verifiable numbers.
You see I can not believe a word you say about Tract K being done with, afterall it was a major proponent, last June, that apparently said at a realtor's meeting that it was a "Done Deal" back then and little birdie makes me think that person could very possibly have been you or was it the proponent who posted the "I never, ever lose, ever" statement? Oh I forgot, you do not know who that was.
Oc - Let's be clear, if you bought a house next to school district owned land and didn't believe there would one day be a school there, I think idiot is a fair label. That's idiot by choice, not because I said so. Their behavior and position of "shock" earned them that label. Please refrain from manipulating the context, you're discounting your own credibility. Remember, these are the same people who picketed Tract K just a few short years ago and said "we don't want a solar park, this land is destined for a school". It's in the archives, look it up and get the facts. What an about face those residents pulled once a school was actually interested in making use of that land. I question their integrity big time. And you tell me my motives are selfish, good comedy.
Oh yes, the fine print of the deed. OK, would you prefer a school bus depot be built there? How would the locals feel about that? Please share what "many" other things might you want there? What other uses are there for school board land? Most school board land are occupied by...schools. Wow, isn't that incredible!?
The only school not built on this island is a HS, what else should they put there? I know you're smarter than that. By the way, how is an eco-park, "school district use"? Already, another violation to the intent and letter of the deed to what that land should be used for. The school board violated state law in approving and arranging that lease. It may get rectified in time. We'll have to see.
I do love it here, and want to make it better. That means progress, and those important parts of a community that make it great. Ironically, great schools are a large part of that greatness. Do you disagree?
If there's a majority who don't want the school, to your point, I haven't seen those numbers. I do see a few limited opponents here, but it's a vocal minority for sure.
If you want proof of successful demand and schooling interest on this island, you need look no farther than Barfield Elementary and MICMS. By the way, the middle school is now at capacity. Appears the demand is so great for that school, they must hold a lottery next year. Those numbers are verifiable, by the way. Look it up, both on the Collier school district website. Should I point out that MICMS is the ONLY middle school in the entire county that achieved their AYP (Adequate Yearly Progress) goal. Yes, the only one. All others in Collier failed to make that goal. That is verifiable too. It's a community school, filled with community resident students. It's the demand that good school programs create, and MIA HS will carry that tradition for HS aged students.
As for your last paragraph, you incorrectly think I am that person you continue to refer to. Sorry, if I seem lost each time you mention it, it's because I don't know anything about that detail.
in response to Tigertail: This HS is going to fail because, their are not enough HS MARCO school children to support the need for another HS in Collier County. Another reason is the fact that there is not a large enough parcel of land to build a new HS on Marco. Even tract k (which you are not going to get) is too small to have a fully functioning HS. The MIA will not offer the multiple athletic programs needed, nor the cultural diversity that kids need to experience at this age. Lastly, the tax payers on Marco do not want to have their taxes raised to pay for this new HS. The private donations will run dry, then who is going to pay for the up keep, teacher salaries, utilities, books, computers, buses, etc....
in response to Tigertail:
This HS is going to fail because, their are not enough HS MARCO school children to support the need for another HS in Collier County. Another reason is the fact that there is not a large enough parcel of land to build a new HS on Marco. Even tract k (which you are not going to get) is too small to have a fully functioning HS. The MIA will not offer the multiple athletic programs needed, nor the cultural diversity that kids need to experience at this age. Lastly, the tax payers on Marco do not want to have their taxes raised to pay for this new HS. The private donations will run dry, then who is going to pay for the up keep, teacher salaries, utilities, books, computers, buses, etc....
Tiger - I disagree that the school will not succeed, but understand your view. If you are basing that view on student count, the numbers are working against you. Each class in elementary and middle school is about 125 students. If Marco doesn't grow (not likely) and each student chooses MIA, then the school will be at the 500 student limit already. Sure that will take a few years, but I have no doubt it will happen. It's just a matter of time.
Tract K was on the school districts plan for a HS in this decade until recently (but that plan was suddenly removed mid-2010), so there's clearly enough room there.
The school will offer programs that are in demand. True, you probably won't see football there, but if that's important to all the future NFL players on Marco, they can choose Lely. Bottom line, just look at Mackle and Winterberry on a Saturday to see how sports active the kids are on this island. A HS isn't less successful if it doesn't offer every single sports and extra curricular club under the sun. It's going to be a niche school, and a large part of that niche will be excellent academics. What parent doesn't want that?
A community school is a representation of the community, so diversity will be as great as the residents surrounding that school. It's not clear to me why so many feel the need to be immersed in diversity to appreciate it or be successful. You're a little too PC and we need to get back to what's important, which are academic subjects and the total HS experience. You don't need football and all other major sports to get that total experience for future college students. The US is 25th of 30 industrial nations in academic performance, we need to be a lot more active in prioritizing academic excellence. Wouldn't you agree? Do you have a better plan to improve from 25th place?
State law does not allow taxes to be levied to pay for a charter school, so I wouldn't be concerned about that. If you are concerned, you need to ping your senator and state congressperson. HS education is compulsory in Florida, so the taxpayers don't have a choice in whether or not a HS can reside here. Just be thankful that your county taxes for education are now staying on the island, instead of getting lost in Naples.
C'mon people, Marco needs your support for the betterment of the future and this island. If you don't want to be a part of it, reconsider your own long term plan.
in response to islandeye1#236971: (This comment was removed by the site staff.)
in response to islandeye1#236971:
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
Island - thanks. I don't know about off island students. Call up the MIA office and ask. My personal opinion is that this is a community based school, so primary focus is the local community (on island). I'd like to know the answers too, but it's outside my decision circle.
I think you're right about the private school theory, but that's probably a positive considering that private school performance results are better and more cost effective than public school results. So, that's a comment that really represents a compliment to the program.
My goal is to understand why people don't feel as positive as I do about this opportunity for the HS students here on Marco, and I want to engage in productive and objective discussion on this subject, with proponents and opponents. Considering, I want to stay up to speed with who engages me for the same objective. Bottom line, the HS years are the most impressionable and formative times for these kids, so they deserve our full force engagement to make sure all the right things are happening and right information is out there. We owe it to these kids. I'm sure any parent would agree?
in response to Ocram: There are more reasons that the system is not working than having your own kids taught by teachers, (Whom you have still failed to provide the credentials and experience for). The system is not working, for a good part, due to the break-up in the family, where parents are more interested on focusing on other things than their own children. The system is not working because kids are not kept to task at home by parents who let their kids call the shots. The system is not working because kids do not learn the basics. The system is not working because "some teachers" are let to get by because of politics or poorly chosen administrators. The system is not working because kids think that sports are the only thing they may have to do well in school in order to make real money. It is not the system, it is how some parents think that they can do a better job developing a charter school rather than helping the existing schools with better funding and honest efforts by the parents to make improvements for all of the kids that need that help. I would rather my tax dollars be spent on experienced teachers and administrators rather than a "fantasy" unproven program. I would not expose my children to such a program until it has proven itself. Not just some pie in the sky unproven claims. Enrollment. Thank you for your answer. If it was already what you would like it to be, you would have said that, with numbers, and not question me on what I was told. My guess you have a long way to go. Why would I like to see it fail? Maybe if you cared about other people rather than your own personal interests you would know the answer to that question? Obviously, it escapes you. I, probably, would have supported the school if it had been at the "Y". It could have developed a foodhold and possibly an honest reputation. Once you went on to "Tract K" you went beyond helping your kids but negatively effecting the lives of people you did not know or obviously care about. You still fail to see that issue as important. You are welcome!
There are more reasons that the system is not working than having your own kids taught by teachers, (Whom you have still failed to provide the credentials and experience for).
The system is not working, for a good part, due to the break-up in the family, where parents are more interested on focusing on other things than their own children. The system is not working because kids are not kept to task at home by parents who let their kids call the shots. The system is not working because kids do not learn the basics. The system is not working because "some teachers" are let to get by because of politics or poorly chosen administrators. The system is not working because kids think that sports are the only thing they may have to do well in school in order to make real money.
It is not the system, it is how some parents think that they can do a better job developing a charter school rather than helping the existing schools with better funding and honest efforts by the parents to make improvements for all of the kids that need that help.
I would rather my tax dollars be spent on experienced teachers and administrators rather than a "fantasy" unproven program. I would not expose my children to such a program until it has proven itself. Not just some pie in the sky unproven claims.
Enrollment. Thank you for your answer. If it was already what you would like it to be, you would have said that, with numbers, and not question me on what I was told. My guess you have a long way to go.
Why would I like to see it fail?
Maybe if you cared about other people rather than your own personal interests you would know the answer to that question? Obviously, it escapes you.
I, probably, would have supported the school if it had been at the "Y". It could have developed a foodhold and possibly an honest reputation. Once you went on to "Tract K" you went beyond helping your kids but negatively effecting the lives of people you did not know or obviously care about.
You still fail to see that issue as important. You are welcome!
Oc - You're right, there are more reasons, like having a local school solution.
Make no mistake, if you want credentials for the teachers, get to working on it. It's your need, not mine. I'm confident in the outcome, if you're not, do your homework. So, fix that failure of yours, I don't need more information to make the right choice.
I disagree about the system, but agree that families are key to the success. This is the primary reason the school needs to be in the community, close to the family, which is why that goal is pushed so hard.
Everything new is unproven, but smart work, collectively efforts and dedication will bring the right result, just wait and see. What's great about your comment is that it reiterates your ability to choose. Having the MIA gives more choice to everyone, and you're welcome to stick with Lely, each of us has that choice.
I care a great deal beyond my own family. In fact, this school is for a great many people, which isn't about my personal interest in anyway. My kids won't be in HS for many years to come, but I'm supportive of this program because I know it will be awesome, and in our community.
So, you still didn't answer why you want it to fail. Seems you're more a part of the problem than the solution. If that's true, then let it go. If you think it won't do well, that's fine, so noted. No value being a hater. You say you would've supported the program at the Y, why a new opinion because the real estate has changed? This would indicate you have some special interest in Tract K. What is it? The location doesn't determine whether an organization will have an honest reputation, where are you coming from on this?
Tract K was school land, it was the logical choice, why is it that people freak out about putting a school on school board land? It's simple and logical. People who own land adjacent to Tract K knew that was school board land when they bought. I have no sympathy for them if they are upset about putting a school on school board land. What kind of idiot couldn't see that coming? Anyway, Tract K is done with, so it's not important anymore. I'm over it, can you get over it?
in response to freedomofspeech1: 30 students for 2 grades???That is a total waste of money to even consider a school! The school board needs to pull this charter before they even get going!There should be a minimum number of at least 100 to even open. How many teachers do you think they will need?? 2 or 3??This is a warning to all Marco parents....run for the hills! Better yet....run for LELY!
30 students for 2 grades???That is a total waste of money to even consider a school! The school board needs to pull this charter before they even get going!There should be a minimum number of at least 100 to even open. How many teachers do you think they will need?? 2 or 3??This is a warning to all Marco parents....run for the hills! Better yet....run for LELY!
Freedom - 30 students with 6 months until enrollment ends, I don't see the problem. If they continue at 30 per month, the school will be near capacity. Be patient, great things take time.
in response to RayPray: Here is the true irony of the Gunga Jane high school project. Whenever I go to the library, it is well used. Same for Mackle Park, always seem to be enough kids there. However, the museum -- built with taxpayer $$$ to satisfy a handful of establishment characters -- has no reason to exist, few exhibits, and no prospect of future traffic. I mean, how many people do you know who moved down here or vacation here because they care anything about the Calusa Indians of Grandma Barfield? If instead of this foolish museum, this lot had been used for the proposed High School, it would have been just the right site. There would have been no eagle upsetting issues. The kids would then have the library just across the street, and the Mackle Park gym, etc 5 minutes away. The best solution for the empty museum is to turn it into the 'Calusa Casino' The proceeds from this gaming venu can then be used for various kid programs....
in response to RayPray:
Here is the true irony of the Gunga Jane high school project.
Whenever I go to the library, it is well used.
Same for Mackle Park, always seem to be enough kids there.
However, the museum -- built with taxpayer $$$ to satisfy a handful of establishment characters -- has no reason to exist, few exhibits, and no prospect of future traffic.
I mean, how many people do you know who moved down here or vacation here because they care anything about the Calusa Indians of Grandma Barfield?
If instead of this foolish museum, this lot had been used for the proposed High School, it would have been just the right site.
There would have been no eagle upsetting issues. The kids would then have the library just across the street, and the Mackle Park gym, etc 5 minutes away.
The best solution for the empty museum is to turn it into the 'Calusa Casino' The proceeds from this gaming venu can then be used for various kid programs....
RayPray - I'm pleased to agree with you on this. Very well said. I've been trying, but still don't understand how that museum got the OK. Nonetheless, I support your input on this, and the non Tract K solution for the HS. Thank you.
in response to Ocram: Why should they send their kids off of the Island since they "discovered a way" to beat the system and get public funding and tax dollars to support a PRIVATE school. One they can control, without the cost of shelling out private school tuition. What a racket! So where are the enrollment numbers now? Are we going to need "another extension" for that too? Watch and see!
Why should they send their kids off of the Island since they "discovered a way" to beat the system and get public funding and tax dollars to support a PRIVATE school. One they can control, without the cost of shelling out private school tuition. What a racket! So where are the enrollment numbers now? Are we going to need "another extension" for that too? Watch and see!
Oc - Yes, ingenuity and dedication, it's the American way. You've got to admit, the system isn't working, which is why a new, local solution was necessary.
Now, the tax dollars we pay each year will finally stay on the Island, I'm all for that, to get spent locally. Why are you OK with sending Marco tax dollars to Naples? That makes no sense.
I was told the enrollment window goes through August, so not sure what you mean about a deadline.
Why are the few of you so focused on seeing this HS fail? Please, tell me why you would want that? I would really like to hear the valid reasoning of your thoughts on this. Thank you.
in response to thefallofRome: Called the school, first told 22 students, then 30 students, so the smoke and mirrors continues by the MIA. Does not look like the interest is there. If so few familys are interested why is this even a issue. Send your kids to SeaCreast, Community school, St Jhon Newman or of course Lely. Looks like a ton of options for your childern, no need to waist money on yet another school building with so many options available.
in response to thefallofRome:
Called the school, first told 22 students, then 30 students, so the smoke and mirrors continues by the MIA. Does not look like the interest is there. If so few familys are interested why is this even a issue. Send your kids to SeaCreast, Community school, St Jhon Newman or of course Lely. Looks like a ton of options for your childern, no need to waist money on yet another school building with so many options available.
Rome - Thanks for the figures. I couldn't find the information in the press but called after I read your note. They told me thirty so far. I asked about the 22 figure you mentioned and they said that was last week's figure. Looks like the enrollments are coming in quickly and consistently. That's a pretty nice increase for one week. They did clarify that the enrollment packets have not even been mailed out to the local 8th & 9th grade resident students yet. It seems the MIA people are pleased with the high enrollment numbers without even getting the information and enrollment sign ups out to the locals yet.
Thanks for sharing the info. When you get a chance, call Lely and see what their numbers are, not that it really matters. MIA is a community school for HS level, just like Barfield and MICMS are for all the elementary and middle school island kids, so having it in the community is the key feature. Thus, no need for Seacrest or St.John, as those options are far from our island. Again, would you drive everyday to Naples for a good meal, when you can eat on Marco? Silly, isn't it.
Island - Thanks for the reminder on this open question. Personally, I don't know what would happen if this were true. I don't know how many are enrolled and my personal opinion is that this seems very unlikely that the majority would be off island kids. But, I suspect the school will publish something on this soon.
I do know they are actively seeking enrollments now, but I don't know what the figures or mix of students are. If I were to guess, I bet 85% will be Marco residents, and higher if you count those who's parents work on the island, but don't live within the city. Again, just my estimate. I tried to find this in the news, but it appears none of the local public schools publish this information.
Happier now you got my 2 cents!?
in response to Ocram: You know as well as I do who the "infamous" comment was made by. I think that it is the person with the same writing style as you. Point to be made. Never said "won't open"....Never said that Jane would leave in "shame". Read the bet and the discussion it related to, if you please. If you know Jane so well, ask her to post the credentials and experience of the teachers for all to see. She did it for the principal. Why not, if they are so outstanding? Is she afraid of the truth?
You know as well as I do who the "infamous" comment was made by. I think that it is the person with the same writing style as you. Point to be made. Never said "won't open"....Never said that Jane would leave in "shame". Read the bet and the discussion it related to, if you please.
If you know Jane so well, ask her to post the credentials and experience of the teachers for all to see. She did it for the principal. Why not, if they are so outstanding?
Is she afraid of the truth?
Oc - Interesting. Thanks for the correction. I'll have to go back and check this out when I have some time.
Couldn't answer about the teachers or Jane Watt's action. I believed there was a news article about them a few weeks ago, but one I do know seems very qualified and will be a strong addition to the program.
What truth do you mean? The truth is...you're looking for any possible issue you can, and I expect it will be impossible to please you. That's unfortunate, but I'm getting used to the naysayers.
in response to marcogolf: Here's a novel idea...send your kids to a school where they're going to get some opportunity to develop into real people instead of trapping them on an island where they will meet nobody new and have no experiences to talk about when they are older. They will go to class and when class is over each day they will come home to mommy and daddy. After class on Friday afternoon, they will sit at home all weekend with nothing to do until Monday morning comes along. They will not be prepared for college life and they will not be prepared for adult life. Don't be selfish...give your kids a chance.
in response to marcogolf:
Here's a novel idea...send your kids to a school where they're going to get some opportunity to develop into real people instead of trapping them on an island where they will meet nobody new and have no experiences to talk about when they are older. They will go to class and when class is over each day they will come home to mommy and daddy. After class on Friday afternoon, they will sit at home all weekend with nothing to do until Monday morning comes along. They will not be prepared for college life and they will not be prepared for adult life. Don't be selfish...give your kids a chance.
golf - thanks again. So you understand my perspective, my kids have lived in 3 states, been to Europe and travel with us consistently to family around the US and my youngest isn't 8 years yet. They are far from sheltered or trapped and the choice to live here is based on a variety of great reasons, save for the fanatic oversight of the few.
I do appreciate your concern, but I must regretfully decline your assistance and my family will choose what's best for my children, their future and their depth and development. Thank you.
in response to Ocram: Tell me, on this blog who the "I never, ever lose, ever" proponent is and I will tell you what my bet is. You see, I have to know, if the person I am making a bet with has the integrity to be honest in order to bet with them. BTW, verifiable confirmation is required.
Tell me, on this blog who the "I never, ever lose, ever" proponent is and I will tell you what my bet is.
You see, I have to know, if the person I am making a bet with has the integrity to be honest in order to bet with them.
BTW, verifiable confirmation is required.
Oc - I wish I could answer this question but I don't know the answer. In my view, it's sounds like a RayPray comment, but I don't know for sure and don't know RayPray's real identity
Basically, I just wanted to take that bet, but to your point, I don't have a method to solve our verification or wager dilemma. Let's agree that we're on the honor system for this one. If you have a plan to solve this, let me know.
In summary, you contend that the HS won't open and Jane Watt will depart Marco in shame. I think the HS will open, and in a few short years, the leaders of the HS (including Jane Watt) will be recognized for pioneering the HS on the island and it's success.
Any smarter people out there have a method to solve this little difference of opinion and keep the wager alive between me and Ocram?
in response to ajm3s: Nice! You actually challenged the "school reform" ist with a request as to Y or Y not the Y was not chosen. I believe in choice, I was hoping the MIA would provide a better choice for students. But talking of a better curriculum does not make a better curriculum. Teachers have a major role, and to date the teacher roster is not complete, but the site selection is or perhaps will not be. But MIA actions and selections to date do mot match the rhetoric. Again, if I wanted a high quality product especially in education, I would think educators are at the top of the list and key. And to date all the hullabaloo has been on location, location, location. Is the MIA simply a real estate investment or an investment in students education? If it is the latter, then focus on your selection of educators; if it is the former, then continue on your current course. I choose the latter where teachers come first for they are the ones that will enliven the curriculum. But then again I am only a student of observation watching from a distance.
in response to ajm3s:
Nice! You actually challenged the "school reform" ist with a request as to Y or Y not the Y was not chosen.
I believe in choice, I was hoping the MIA would provide a better choice for students. But talking of a better curriculum does not make a better curriculum. Teachers have a major role, and to date the teacher roster is not complete, but the site selection is or perhaps will not be. But MIA actions and selections to date do mot match the rhetoric.
Again, if I wanted a high quality product especially in education, I would think educators are at the top of the list and key. And to date all the hullabaloo has been on location, location, location. Is the MIA simply a real estate investment or an investment in students education? If it is the latter, then focus on your selection of educators; if it is the former, then continue on your current course.
I choose the latter where teachers come first for they are the ones that will enliven the curriculum.
But then again I am only a student of observation watching from a distance.
ajm - Agreed, the right teachers are key. I don't know who the teachers are, so I must reserve my comments until I see what the teacher roster is.
I do know that MIA plans to bring in the ACE curriculum along with honors & AP. What I know of ACE is that the top performing charter schools in the nation are using it, and doing so very successfully. True, however, planning and implementing are not the same. I am willing to see if they can deliver it.
As for real estate, I read before that they pursued and investigated over 15 sites on the island, and were stopped at almost every step. So, the real estate issue is because of opposition, and likely not due to their choice.
I like your comments and think you should share them with the MIA people. Let them know you have a high expectation. It's the right thing to give your input for a better result here. All of Marco will eventually benefit from this endeavor.
in response to dwbadger: MarcoDefender My hat off to you....your posts actually are well written and I sense a passion for your position. I believe a HS on the Island will cost tax payers money. The MIA accebemy has not addressed the question of where the money for the infrastructure costs and continued operating cost will come from. There will be costs incurred for additional police, roadwork, sewer work, etc. Many of these costs will continue each and every year. Will the students parents absorb these additional costs? I also wonder how everyone can be confident that the MIA will be "A" rated. Teachers have not been hired and the curriculum completed so this question remains and will not be answered for years to come. A community school is a lofty goal and I believe had the school plan to begin at the YMCA and serve the community children been followed the community would not have reacted the way it did. It was when it was decided that the school enrollment should expand to 600 students that the oppostion gained momentum. To have a school that size means that other children would have to be bussed onto the island which is exactly what the MIA parents are saying they do not want to do with their children (bus off the island) I would like to see the plan to pay for the school in detail and how all of the operating costs will be covered. The county will send money on a per student basis at the same rate that it costs to operate Lely. I don't think that is sufficient, but the total costs have not been presented.
in response to dwbadger:
MarcoDefender
My hat off to you....your posts actually are well written and I sense a passion for your position.
I believe a HS on the Island will cost tax payers money. The MIA accebemy has not addressed the question of where the money for the infrastructure costs and continued operating cost will come from. There will be costs incurred for additional police, roadwork, sewer work, etc. Many of these costs will continue each and every year. Will the students parents absorb these additional costs?
I also wonder how everyone can be confident that the MIA will be "A" rated. Teachers have not been hired and the curriculum completed so this question remains and will not be answered for years to come.
A community school is a lofty goal and I believe had the school plan to begin at the YMCA and serve the community children been followed the community would not have reacted the way it did. It was when it was decided that the school enrollment should expand to 600 students that the oppostion gained momentum. To have a school that size means that other children would have to be bussed onto the island which is exactly what the MIA parents are saying they do not want to do with their children (bus off the island)
I would like to see the plan to pay for the school in detail and how all of the operating costs will be covered. The county will send money on a per student basis at the same rate that it costs to operate Lely. I don't think that is sufficient, but the total costs have not been presented.
dwbadger - Thanks for the note and the hat tip. I just want to see some productive discussion on this subject. Thank you for the good points in your response. Here's my quick view on each:
Since only the temporary HS site is known, let's speak to that. I think that land is already zoned and dedicated as per the owner's intended use from years ago, but the school will have to pay out of pocket for utility and sewer hook ups, so there's no city cost there. Considering these HS kids already live here, I don't see a valid reason why more fire or police are required. If there's something I'm missing there, please feel free to share, I want to be and feel fully informed. Considering we have public works in this city, costs are present whether there's a school or not. I too am curious what and how much these incremental costs will be, but haven't seen any details to support if or how much they may be. Perhaps the city has information on that.
As for the A rating, I would contend that the same students rising from TB Elementary (an A school) to MI Charter Middle School (another A school) will come to MIA. If they continue to perform as they have, and the teachers and curriculum deliver, I think there will be some strong rating performance. But, this needs to be watched closely.
As for costs, I would recommend you get a copy of their charter application. It's public record and I contacted the school district to get a copy. All the schools costs are inclusive, and it was interesting to read. It was also interesting to see how detailed and comprehensive their proposal was. I would suggest you check that out, that way you can form a solid view based on the facts they presented to the school district review group and school board, which eventually granted their approval. They must have done somethings right, especially since the board originally rejected it.
in response to 1Paradiselost: MarcoDefender Nice speech! I've got this information from a good source, that the permits to move the turtles will NOT be granted. It seems that the cost to move the turtles will be the issue. You still have the "Y" property where you had taxpayer support. The city is going to build you a real nice building over at Mackle Park. It's the perfect location.
in response to 1Paradiselost:
Nice speech! I've got this information from a good source, that the permits to move the turtles will NOT be granted.
It seems that the cost to move the turtles will be the issue.
You still have the "Y" property where you had taxpayer support.
The city is going to build you a real nice building over at Mackle Park. It's the perfect location.
1P Lost - Interesting about the permits. I hope this is not true, but I haven't heard or read anything.
The Y...I believe that's a done deal. I also haven't read anything new on that.
No need for taxpayer support, no taxes are allowed to be levied to support a charter school, that's Florida state law. I'm not worried about it, and don't think you should be. I'm more concerned about other city spending issues, like this water rate situation, which is outrageous.
Mackle Park is always packed, they need more space, I'm pleased to see it. I am hopeful it works out, but you can always count on opposition to any progress on this island. I'm sure it will be another 50/50 situation.
Ocram - I'm still waiting on what you're willing to wager?
Island I - Avoiding what questions? I have nothing to hide, and you will surely get my candid response. Tell me what you'd like to know. I'm happy to engage with you on this important HS subject.
So, you say it's "absurd" to travel to Naples each day, I couldn't agree with you more. Thank you for proving how crazy such a daily endeavor is, when you can easily dine, or in this case, learn in your own community.
You're right, eagles are protected. It makes me wonder why you need any more protection than federal and state law. Oh, yes, here comes The Eagle Sanctuary. Pay no mind that their incorporation papers with the State of Florida reflect that they are completely opposed to Tract K school board land being used for a school. No too vindictive, are we!?
I break no laws, and only expect that we each follow them fairly and toward their intent. When a school board votes against schools and students, it would appear laws and board member oaths are being broken.
Yes, Marco Walk. Another broken promise and poor result of Deltona's good intent. I can't rationalize old mistakes, but surely don't think they should be repeated. Two wrongs don't make a right situation.
The charter school will open, and if Lely is hurt then Lely needs to pull their act together. Already I've read that Lely will now offer new hi tier curriculum this coming year that wasn't previously offered, but discussed many times in the past years. Wow, the MIAHS is offering that hi tier curriculum this fall, I wonder if there's any correlation? Competition, innovation and incentive. It's a beautiful thing and it's what you get when choice are introduced.
If current Lely students expect to suffer, I would encourage them to apply to MIAHS, it's public and open for enrollment right now. Why fight em, when you can join them...and turn that risk into an opportunity. I want to see everyone successful, even you. But Lely has had too many years with lackluster performance and their chances are done. Marco students and parents don't find that acceptable anymore, and that's why there will be a HS on this island this fall. If Lely students want some consideration, then trot on down to Marco Island. If it's acceptable for Islanders to travel to Naples, then vice versa shouldn't be a problem.
You people are always thinking backwards and behind the times. We need school reform and this is where it starts, with choice.
Yes, I want my children on this island, where I live, work, play and enjoy the community, and most of the community members. Is that so bad, to be pro-Marco?!
This isn't about race, color, gender or any other poor label, it's about learning in the community (like all students already do at the elementary and middle school level) and high expectations.
As for turtles, I have read no new information there.
in response to marcogolf: Football games, baseball games, cheerleading, debate clubs, science fairs, proms, etc. are all part of high school and a teen's growth and development. None of that will exist at a HS on Marco. Trapping our kids on an island is selfish parenting and is no good for the kids. They need to experience the real world and teen life on an island with 20 or so other classmates is not the real world.
Football games, baseball games, cheerleading, debate clubs, science fairs, proms, etc. are all part of high school and a teen's growth and development. None of that will exist at a HS on Marco. Trapping our kids on an island is selfish parenting and is no good for the kids. They need to experience the real world and teen life on an island with 20 or so other classmates is not the real world.
marcogolf - yes, and like anything in life, demand will dictate what will be offered at MIAHS.
Here's a novel idea, let the island parents decide what's best for their children and how they should be raised. I'm sure you got the same consideration when you raised yours. If I need your opinion on what's best for mine, I'll be in touch. BTW - Don't hold your breath too long waiting for my call.
in response to Ocram: Marco Defender,, Sometimes laws have to be changed to correct the deficiencies between what was witten and the intent.
Marco Defender,,
Sometimes laws have to be changed to correct the deficiencies between what was witten and the intent.
Oc - Until the law is changed, all us good citizens must comply.
Island I - Yes, I'm dedicated, because that's how great things happen, with commitment and persistence.
Yes, I think it's appropriate to have a community school solution at the high school level, yes. We have it at the elementary and middle school level, there's no good reason not to have a HS level locally available. Those 2 island schools are packed full of great students, and the schools are "A" rated. What's the problem?
Making a case to go to Lely for schooling is equivalent to asking you to have all your dinner restaurant visits up US41 in Naples. Do you want to travel out to the Lely resort area to have dinner every night? No, you probably eat locally. Why, because it's convenient and in your community. Perhaps you'll run into some friends, or run into local neighbors who know you there. The same applies for the kids. it's silly that they must travel 120 miles each week to get a HS education, not to mention that Lely isn't exactly an academically noted school. How would you like to travel to that restaurant in Naples each night for a "C" rated meal? I bet it wouldn't take you long to reconsider the time, money and travel spent for that so-so dining experience. Welcome to the Marco HS student's world when Lely has been their only choice. Well, no more. Those days are over.
OK, taxes, let's talk about that. Ironically, there's no incremental tax burden here, just a redirection of Marco tax dollars paid to Collier County, which will NOW stay on this Island. Imagine that, island dollars staying on the Island, what a scandal!?. So yes, at any cost, really is NO COST to you. No incremental cost to Marco tax payers, do...you...understand? Also, I think it's fair to say neither you, nor I, are qualified to speak for the majority of taxpayers. Every non-scientific poll ever done on this subject is 50/50, which doesn't equate to definitive majority by any stretch.
There are already HS students on this island, why do you think there will be disruption if they have a place to learn locally. The HS is way over on San Marco, so the impact to the island is near non-existent. Plus, what disruption do you mean? Be specific, so we can have an objective conversation about it.
The Tract K debacle is shameful. When stewards of our local education system prioritize a few animals over students, which should be the primary and sole focus of a school board member, it reeks of injustice. I have no doubt that the mess created here will be rectified in due time. The Mackle brothers would be turning in their graves if they witnessed that pathetic result supported by the school board with Tract K, a section of land dedicated to school use in this county.
in response to Ocram: THERE IS NO MAJORITY WITHOUT A REFERENDUM. BUT THE ACADEMY DID ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING BUT PUSH FOR AN HONEST ANSWER TO THIS QUESTION AND HAVE A REFERENDUM. IT DOES NOT TAKE BRAINS TO FIGURE OUT WHY? WITHOUT THE REFERENDUM THEY CAN CONTINUE TO MAKE UNFOUNDED CLAIMS.
THERE IS NO MAJORITY WITHOUT A REFERENDUM.
BUT THE ACADEMY DID ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING BUT PUSH FOR AN HONEST ANSWER TO THIS QUESTION AND HAVE A REFERENDUM.
IT DOES NOT TAKE BRAINS TO FIGURE OUT WHY?
WITHOUT THE REFERENDUM THEY CAN CONTINUE TO MAKE UNFOUNDED CLAIMS.
Ocram - State and Federal law make education to age 16 a compulsory action. Thus, no need for a majority vote. They all have to follow the law. We all do.
Also, charter law in Florida doesn't require community approval to form a school. I suspect the Academy focused on what was required, and since a vote was not, why bother?
What claims are unfounded? Please educate us.
IslandEye - Seriously, that's your interpretation!? I'm just asking for some reasonable dialogue between all of us. Asking to be civil isn't talking down, it's good peer communication.
Self centered means it's all about me, but my interest in this interaction is about the children and betterment of this island. Please, let's focus on the facts, not the personality & bragging of the contributors.
in response to Ocram: If I were to be able to make a bet, this is what I would bet on. Lely will grow and improve due to the efforts of Marco Island parents, the MIA will be all but a memory, Jane will haved moved to a place that makes her and her whole family happy.
If I were to be able to make a bet, this is what I would bet on.
Lely will grow and improve due to the efforts of Marco Island parents, the MIA will be all but a memory, Jane will haved moved to a place that makes her and her whole family happy.
Ocram - I'll take that bet. You have no idea how dedicated and committed that group of MIA parents, supporters and leaders are.
I'd like Lely to succeed, but history is against them and Lely is not in our community. We need a community school, just like the awesome elementary and middle school that already exists here.
Tell me this, were you opposed to the middle charter school when it was being proposed 10+ years ago? If yes, what were your reasons? Well, now that you can see the great success of that school, are you surprised? If you bet then, you would have lost. Are you really confident in your choice, or just wishful (possibly a little spiteful)?
Bottomline, there's no need to be against a school in this community. If you like Lely, then go to Lely. Too many people want a community school for their kids and it will happen.
So let me know what the wager is?
DC - Have you been to Mackle Park lately? It's very busy, busting at the seems with all the use, classes, meetings hosted for various groups, fitness enthusiasts and, dare I say it, children.
If there's justification for open land and dedicated park space for a few eagles, surely you can see the rationale for expanding a park with needed space to support what all those citizens use on this island. Sorry that people require chairs, air conditioned rooms for use in the hot summer and toilets, unlike our low maintenance friends of a feather that now have 11 protected acres over on Tract K. Unfortunately you need a bigger building to accommodate those "human needs".
Come on, you can't have everything. Granted, I place the highest priority on fiscal management, however, I also recognize the value on return on investment, and clearly there some excellent usage and value there.
Whiskey Tango - Love the handle, well done. I enjoyed your comments to marcogolf, again, well done.
- RayPray / 1Paradise - At least try to remain civil, please.
Great, you're the king of your domain and made a fortune, that doesn't qualify you for special rights. You're equal to everyone else. Certainly bragging about it reflects some inferiority and lack of self confidence.
Now, take just a moment, and think beyond your life, what legacy will remain? What good will you leave behind? Certainly you shouldn't be proud of your behavior here, on the subjects we discuss. I would encourage you to consider some altruism in your sunset years. Your life will likely be worth more than your asset value (which you can't take with you anyway), and you won't die while appearing to be so bitter and angry.
in response to Ocram: SUPPORT LELY AND RECEIVE A "REAL, HONEST TO GOODNESS" HIGH SCHOOL EXPERIENCE! IF NEEDED, PUT YOUR EFFORTS INTO IMPROVING AREAS OF YOUR CONCERN IN ORDER TO BENEFIT ALL. RECEIVE AN EDUCATION FROM EDUCATORS AND ADMINISTRATORS WITH YEARS OF ON THE JOB EXPERIENCE. YOU WILL BE HAPPY AND YOU CHILDREN WILL BE HAPPY YOU DID.
SUPPORT LELY AND RECEIVE A "REAL, HONEST TO GOODNESS" HIGH SCHOOL EXPERIENCE!
IF NEEDED, PUT YOUR EFFORTS INTO IMPROVING AREAS OF YOUR CONCERN IN ORDER TO BENEFIT ALL.
RECEIVE AN EDUCATION FROM EDUCATORS AND ADMINISTRATORS WITH YEARS OF ON THE JOB EXPERIENCE.
YOU WILL BE HAPPY AND YOU CHILDREN WILL BE HAPPY YOU DID.
Ocram - Just like your blog name, you got it backwards...again!
People, remember, the best aspect of this controversial MIA Charter HS is...each of the students / families can choose. If you want Lely, go to Lely. If you're pro-Marco and want a continuous "A" rated education, then you can CHOOSE the HS on Marco.
The power of choice and competition is an American axiom. We need that to progress in this world, where the US is currently ranked 25 of 30 industrialized nations in core subject matter like Math and Reading. That's unacceptable! Can you possibly disagree?!
No attendance because the school board & school district can't get it right.
Yes, they want to hear from "us", but then they run meetings and don't allow "us" to share our important views. So much for the Sunshine Law. I guess they just follow the rules when it suits them.
If you think the $1 billion dollars of Collier School District dollars are well spent, then you have nothing to share. If you think they are FAILING the kids and our residents, then you have it right. Thankfully, the consultants appropriately recommended a far more reasonable salary for this position at $200,000 instead of the nearly $300,000 that was discussed.
Steve - You don't speak for me, or the "majority" of MI residents. What the school board did was illegal and will be rectified appropriately in time. It's a shame to see Americans place the advocacy of animals over that of human beings, particularly those who just want to improve their opportunities in education on this island. This HS will be a continuation of the "A" rated community schooling that the kids enjoy on the Island now with Tommie Barfield and the Middle Charter School. For the school board to place a priority on a function over that of quaility schooling is clearly a breach of their duty.
Sure, $30,000 of revenue from a lease compared to a Collier School District 2010 budget of $961 million dollars (yes, nearly a billion dollars folks).
It's like adding a glass of water into the Mackle Park lake and calling it favorable water management.
A nice example of your local government at work.
Ocram / RayPray - We get it, you're against the Academy.
Please, save your subjective inputs. The majority of us know the truth about how excellent this program and school will be. I bet neither of you know these two excellent coaches & teachers, yet you chime in with comments on these individuals.
You know the drill, if you don't have anything nice to say...
in response to Ocram: Shame on the MIA for trying to maneuver what could have been a good idea to educate our island's and turning it into something far beyond the needs or wants of the majority of this community. If you do not think so, ask for a referendum. Selfish is not caring about anybody else's life than that of your own. You moved here knowing what was available, so what is the problem? Change things for everyone else to satisfy your own personal needs. Who should be ashamed? Why are you now talking about Island Children Only? I thought the desire was to bus in another 250 from Lely to fill this "World Class" dream. If island children were your only concern, which now seems the case, then you should have stuck with the "Y" until proving yourself to be equipped to take on expansion. Tax dollar spending should go to educate everyone living in that taxed area, it should not be funneled to people who think they are more deserving or better than others.
Shame on the MIA for trying to maneuver what could have been a good idea to educate our island's and turning it into something far beyond the needs or wants of the majority of this community. If you do not think so, ask for a referendum.
Selfish is not caring about anybody else's life than that of your own. You moved here knowing what was available, so what is the problem? Change things for everyone else to satisfy your own personal needs. Who should be ashamed?
Why are you now talking about Island Children Only? I thought the desire was to bus in another 250 from Lely to fill this "World Class" dream. If island children were your only concern, which now seems the case, then you should have stuck with the "Y" until proving yourself to be equipped to take on expansion.
Tax dollar spending should go to educate everyone living in that taxed area, it should not be funneled to people who think they are more deserving or better than others.
Ocram - What...shame on a school with an approved charter to seek school land on the island where the school will be located? It's logical, please don't tell me you see this! If not, I worry for you girl.
If there's justification for an elementary and middle school, isn't it logical that a high school would follow. Both schools are already very successful. In fact, MICMS is the ONLY middle school in the entire county that met AYP this year. The ONLY ONE! There's nothing personal about wanting local children, to have a local high school solution, that has a reasonable rating of success. Would you find it acceptable to have a "C" rated doctor, or your having your roof replaced by a "C" rated contractor, or have your retirement account managed by a "C" rated investment manager? I didn't think so. You let us school children parents decide what's acceptable for our Island kids, it's obvious you don't have any kids, or your views would be on the right side of this equation.
Tax dollar spending should bring value. Right now all tax dollars go to Lely for a HS solution. it's "C" rated value, outside our community and hours of commute each week. Sorry, no thanks. Wouldn't you rather have your Marco tax dollars stay on Marco? Getting pumped back into our local economy? There's a reason why MIA has 60 teacher applications for 9 teaching positions, the people who know the school situation the best (teachers), know a great thing when it comes along.
I'm hopeful you opponents will come to your senses soon.
Islandeye - No denying, if they want a true "C" rated HS experience, they are free to choose Lely. That's the value of choice. Portable classrooms are part of school life in Collier County, and there will be many more with Amendment 8. The building is not important, but the learning, the opportunity, the charter experience, being in the community and having local support (you excluded), are what's important. Besides, pioneers made this country and island what it is today, to curse them would be to hypocritical since you now enjoy what those pioneers created for you, for all of us on Marco. Get your priorities straight, kids need and deserve more advocacy than turtles.
Ocram - They just opened enrollment, sit back and watch this come together. A year from now you'll be biting your lips with anger. Too bad, you could be part of a great, positive change for students, the city and this community. I hope you come to your senses at some point.
Ray - Time to up the donepezil dosage.
The MIA will open in August, there's nothing to stop it now. Freedom and choice will prevail. This is America, afterall.
Before you slam the new principal, you might want to actual meet him. He's an impressive professional and educator.
I'll enjoy looking back at this a year or two from now, how amazed all you opponents will be when we have one of the best new HS programs in the state of Florida.
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