marconews.com Accounts

Perversion of Logic

The Marco Island City Council allows QE to grind up thousands of pounds of asbestos on Veteran’s Park. A group of concerned citizens brings this to the attention of the council which denies and ignores the problem. The citizens report this event to the proper authorities. The EPA requires a 1 million dollar clean up of the contamination and fines QE $65,000. The city manager goes on area wide television and claims the asbestos was planted by citizens and a criminal investigation is launched. The city manager and a councilman claim they have photographic evidence to prove citizens planted the asbestos and withstand a 6 month effort to produce the evidence. The councilman ultimately admits he does not have any photographic evidence.

The Council ignores claims from dozens of citizens that their health is threatened by the hydrogen sulfide that is produced by the dewatering required by the STRP. The council ignores a claim from a local doctor that over 700 patients have complained of illnesses linked to exposure to hydrogen sulfide. Two workers are taken to the hospital, one in critical condition as a result of exposure to the hydrogen sulfide. The citizens are forced to procure their own meter to measure the gas and prove the level of hydrogen sulfide exceeds safe EPA levels. The city spends $100,000 hiring consultants who confirm levels exceed EPA standards. The city spends $400,000 to correct the health hazard..

The city suffers a major blow to its image as a result of these events. In a twisted reversal of accountability the pro city candidate supporters claim the negativity is the responsibility of people that reported the environmental hazards, not the council that allowed them to happen. We are supposed to “Be Positive” and ignore these hazards.

We need a fresh approach to the leadership of Marco Island. We need a council that will respect and protect the health and rights of our citizens rather than treating them as battlefield casualties. That is why I am running for council. Vote for Batte, Hall, Guidry and Neylon..

Roger Hall
Marco Island

Butch, Ms. Pavlov spoke before the council as far back as 2005 and again in 2006 in support of the STRP. Her integrity is revealed in her ruse that she is just a simple minded citizen that hadn't made up her mind until after your preseentation. The lack of honesty by the pro sewer people is the cancer that is destroying our city.

You’ all are looking through the wrong end of the telescope. The man is exercising a little creativity and trying to improve the appearance of our island. He deserves applause for his efforts not a lot of petty criticism. Keep up the good work Larry, it is people like you that will make Marco a better place. We need more people like you. Thanks for your efforts.

Roger Hall

Dr. Ray Paret is one of the most intelligent and wonderful people on this island. He has lived here for many years and has only the best interests of the island at heart.

He has a degree in bio-chemistry and physics from Queens College in NY and a DDS from the Medical College of Virginia.

To his credit he only uses his Dr. credentials when he is addressing a matter in which he has expertise. He does not use it when addressing other matters.

I hope this will stop the petty, mean spirited attacks on this great citizen which appear to follow the familiar pattern of attacking the messenger in an attempt to distract from the message.

Roger Hall

I am happy to report that the earlier information I received regarding capacity was wrong. I am now told that the council room can seat up to 200 voters. That is good news.

Roger Hall

It is sad to see the hate slate poisoning the debate as usual. Don't misquote me and then say I lied as is the pattern of the Mossites.

I said that during the past two years the contractors have pumped millions of gallons of water that was surrounding the septic systems into our canals. The city has assured us that there has been no septic system contamination in this water. I am sure they have done the testing. I never said I did. If the septic systems are not contaminating the water immediately adjacent to them it is absurd that they are sending contamination to our canals. This is a no brainer.

I also invited the citizens to observe the sand being dug in the laterals that were dewatered. I pointed out that the sand from the excavations from homes that have septic systems and the sand from vacant lots looks identical. I never said I tested it. Since the water that came from this sand was dumped into our canals I can only assume that the city telling us the truth when they say it doesn't contain any septic tank contamination.

I these are fairly obvious common sense conclusions.

I was also called a liar when I stated that I wasn't sure how many the new council chamber held but I was informed that it was less than a 100. Don't call me a liar, just tell us the correct number and I will acknowledge that I was misinformed.

Don't we have enough problems in this city without inflaming the discourse with gratuitous nastiness?

Roger Hall

5. We agree that we need to educate our owners as to how to maintain their systems to ensure a long and useful life span. That is part of the Kiester plan.

5.A We agree that the city has the right to select the sewer system they chose. I don’t agree that anytime a central sewer system is available it is the preferred method of disposal. The Florida Stormwater education site states: “Septic Systems can treat wastewater better than most sewage treatment facilities at a fraction of the cost and can last indefinitely. So what’s the catch? Homeowners must make sure the system is properly designed, installed and maintained.” Here is the link to the site: http://www.tappwater.org/what-septic....

6. One has to temper the representation with condition of the central sewer system. The largest cause of beach closures in this country are the failures of central sewer systems. The central system on Marco Island is approaching 50 years old and little if anything has been done to maintain it. The city represents that we have an inflow of 1 million gallons of groundwater a day during the rainy season. The industry recognizes that the outflow from central sewer systems amounts to between 17 to 30 percent of the inflow. Our central system, which is overdue for replacement, is leaking between 170,000 to 300,000 gallons a day of raw sewerage into our aquifer. It would seem that taking 6,500 users off their non- polluting septic systems and adding them to this very porous central system is not in the best interest of our environment. The beach closures on Sanibel and Captiva last August/September were related to leaking outflow from the central sewer system either in Ft. Myers or on the island itself. It had nothing to do with septic systems.

It is clear that these are very important issues and there is much controversy and misinformation surrounding them. Rather than conduct an information campaign via e-mails and the local media, it is obvious that a public information meeting certainly is called for in order to establish a clear distinction between facts and fiction, including a discussion of a viable septic tank maintenance program. A well informed citizenry is the backbone of any democracy. I will do anything that is necessary to organize such a meeting which I believe is long overdue. Would you department be willing to help?

Sincerely,

Roger Hall
Marco Island

OPEN LETTER TO KEN RECH
ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH AND ENGINEERING DIRECTOR
COLLIER COUNTY, FL

June 6, 2007

Dear Mr. Rech:

As you may suspect your e-mail to me has precipitated a lot of attention on Marco Island. I am sorry that you believe that I took your remarks out of context as that was certainly not my intent. I pointed out to you that this is a politically charged situation on Marco. I didn’t wish to expose you to the political pressures I believed your comments would generate without forewarning you. The government on Marco Island has a track record of “seek and destroy” all those that would disagree with them and I certainly didn’t intend to put any words in you mouth.

In an effort to ensure that I was accurately reflecting our conversation I wrote notes, which I read to you as we spoke. I sent you an e-mail reiterating our conversation giving you the opportunity to review and adjust any of your comments before I quoted you. I further stated councilman Kiester would be calling you to have much the same discussion. You gave me your e-mail address and I sent that e-mail at 9:41 on Monday morning as I said I would. You knew it was coming. I don’t know what more I could have done to insure I was quoting you accurately. It is unfortunate that you did not respond to it for a day and a half.

Having said that, as I read your e-mail of 4:20 PM 6/05/07 I find we agree on most of the items in your e-mail. I have incorporated your comments as I read them in an effort to establish our common ground.

1. You do not dispute the representation that there isn’t any need to replace the septic tanks on Marco Island either now or in the future. What you have added, which I agree with, is that septic systems, as with anything else in this world, must be maintained and they don’t last forever without replacement and repair. We have a plan, the Kiester plan, that provides for a septic tank inspection program to monitor and inspect the systems on a regular basis.

2. You do not dispute that there are no federal or state regulations that will force the replacement of our septic tanks either now or in the future. We agree the city can mandate connection to a sewer system as they are doing on Marco Island. We agree that the use of decentralized systems and alternates to central sewer are under consideration in many parts of the country and Florida. Again, we agree that private septic systems need proper maintenance and oversight for long term use.

Mr. Issler,

I don't know what motivates you. I would like to believe it is a search for the truth and what is best for Marco Island but I am beginning to believe you are more motivated by some extreme dislike for me despite the fact that we have never met or spoken.

You have a pattern and reputation of misstating the facts. You have made the allegations regarding the 10,000 petitions involved in the recall in the past. I have responded as I have below and offered to let you count them.

In an effort to clear up any misunderstanding at the expense of repeating myself:

I have 4,700 petitions signed by approximately 1,700 voters that have been validated by the Collier County Board of Elections.

I have approximately 6,000 petitions signed by approximately 2,100 voters that are waiting to be validated if we win our appeal.

All of these peitions are available for your inspection and counting at my home at 1260 Osprey Ct. You may call me at 970 0060 to set up a time when you can come and count them.

I hope this clears up any concerns you may have in this matter.

Roger Hall

Thank you Chuck for your efforts. I applaud you willingness to stand up for the citizens despite the fact that you know you and they will be rejected by the arrogant majority on this council.

Roger Hall

It is important to recognize that the 4.5% surtax the voters are being asked to approve on the sewer referendum will go up dramatically when the save our homes exemption goes away. If not this session, the next. Once the government sets it sights on getting rid of a tax saving program they don't give up until it is gone.

The lip service about enabling the voters to choose between the save our homes exemption or the new tax rate is a smoke screen, it will never happen. It will just go away. If they were going to allow us to keep the exemption, why wouldn't they have built their program from that starting point?

Marco homesteaded voters need to recognize this is a compelling reason to vote NO NO on the referendum.

Roger Hall

I was a realator in California for many years. We always believed that curb appeal was the key to selling a property. Marco Island's curb appeal has been destroyed and the market won't recover until it is restored. Stop kidding yourselves!

The image of this island has been and continues to be destroyed by the widespread construction. If you look at the island through the eyes of a visitor what would you see that would motivate you to live here? The place is a dump. Half finished construction projects languish on for months, roads torn up every where you look, construction staging areas on every piece undeveloped of property the city owns. And you ain't seen nothing yet!

Unless something is done, this will continue for years to come. Nobody is talking about the fact that 60% of the island has a sewer system that is 50 years old and leaks badly. It will have to be replaced in addition to the extending the STRP to additional 5,000 homes starting next year. During the rainy season, a million gallons a day of ground water leaks into our sewer system because it is so porous. Industry standards tell us that same system is leaking 17 to 30 percent of this amount into our aquifer every day of the year. This means 170,000 to 300,000 gallons a day of raw sewerage is leaking into our goundwater. A simuliar outflow from either the Ft. Meyers or the Saniabel system is what caused the closure of their beaches last August/September. I am afraid the same disaster is in store for Marco Island. What is going to happen to real estate sales if we have to close our beaches? We need to fix the existing system, not add another 6,500 homes to it.

More importantly, we need to stop the madness, stop the construction, clean up the island, restore peace and tranquility, and then consider what projects we really need to undertake. I recently met a couple who were selling the home they built in 2003 at a 30% loss so they could move to Lely. They just couldn't take it any longer. There are a lot of those people out there. This market is years away from recovery but we had better stop the bleeding now before we all go broke.

Roger Hall

So much for my attempt for an honest debate. All the hate slate can do is insult because they don't have any facts. Cowardly insults from people that are too small to sign their names are not worth acknowledging. For the rest of you I offer:

THE STRP HOAX

The Septic Tank Replacement Program, STRP, was initially justified on the basis our septic tanks were polluting the canals. When the data disproved that theory we were told the septic tanks were spreading their pollution and would pollute our canals in the future. There is irrefutable evidence this is not true.
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If you inspect the laterals that are being installed to the homes and vacant lots where the system is under construction you will note that there isn’t any difference in the sand or trenches that are being dug from the trenches to existing homes, typically right up to the septic system, or vacant lots. The systems aren’t even migrating a few feet let alone the 100 feet most of them are from the canals.

The city has been dewatering the areas immediately surrounding our septic tanks for over a year. The City’s web site states: “Installation of “well points” (to remove groundwater) will generate water, sand, and silt within the swales. This groundwater will have an unpleasant odor (caused by decaying organic matter in the ground), but it is a natural process and not a health or environmental issue.”

In this statement the City states that despite pumping millions of gallons of water from the area immediately adjacent to and surrounding the septic systems there isn’t any evidence of sewage in our water table. If there was it would be a health or environmental issue and they would be treating it before they dumped it into the canals.

We are spending $135 million dollars and tearing up our island to fix a problem that doesn’t exist! I would ask that those who hold some influence with the council bring their councilperson to the site, observe for your selves and ask “Why are we doing this?”

Roger Hall
Marco Island

Point well taken. I differentiate between personal attacts and attacks on a government or anonymous hate mongers. Perhaps that is too fine a distinction. I will elevate my discourse. Thank you.

Roger Hall

We have another anonymous hate response from the hate slate. The fact that the son-in-law of the city manager has enjoyed a blind eye from code enforcement while Godfrey Davis has been singled out for code enforcement persecution for cutting mangroves trees that turned out to be pepper trees shows just how corrupt this administration is. You should be ashamed.

Roger Hall

We have the usual response by the hate slate. Demean and insult the messanger; ignore the message and pick on some relatively minor point. The point of my letter was that this city is fiscally irresponsible and the more money they have, the more they will spend. The only way to stop the madness is to shut off the flow of funds.

I stated I had 10,000 petitions in my possession rejecting the leadership of Minozzi, Tucker, and Trotter. That would be over 1600 each signed by registered voters and validated by the board of elections for a total of 4,800 for the first round of petitions. I also have approximately 2,000 each of the second petition which includes the councilmen's defense for a total of 6,000. This is a total of 10,800 different petitions. My phone number is in the book. Call me if you want to came and count them. You can bring your voter registration log with you and insure that the second group are all registered voters. We have vetted them and they are in alphabetical order ready to go if the court rules in our favor.

Maybe now you can get past the insults and hear the message.

Roger Hall
Marco Island

I did not start any lawsuit. I implored the council to keep our problems on the island and let the citizens’ vote as authorized by the charter. The council members filed the lawsuit to stop the recall. They were the ones that used the courts to thwart the democratic process. We met the requirements set by the charter that gave us the right to vote. The councilmen used our money and the courts to deprive us of those rights.

Roger Hall

The bottom line is that any responsible citizen is appalled by the fact that the tax payers are picking up a $950,000 cleanup tab for QE. That is indefensible. The Moss sycophants can only insult and attack the citizens trying to protect the city. It is telling they have to hide behind their pseudonyms while spouting this childish venom. At least Ed Eisler has the courage to use his own name.
Roger Hall

I simply pointed out tht asbestos leeching from water lines was a concern recognized by every informed water systems manager and that Mr. Moss's comment that he had never heard of this only reflected his lack of competence. I never alleged it was a health hazzard.

The numbers supplied for installing reuse water lines are based in the installation in virgin ground, not in the open trenches that we will have. Common sense dictates that the industry figures of $10 to $20 per foot for open trenches to install PVC pipe make sense.

The web site for the city of Cape Coral states they use 100% of their waste water. According to their city enginer they discharged excessive water into the river 6 times last year. They are reviewing ASR wells but have not made a final decision to proceed with them.

The issues not addressed are:
1. What about the million of gallons of additional water that will be generated by the 6,000 new users that will be brought on line by the STRP?
2. Why can't we use inexpensive raw water mixed with reuse water on our lawns instead of treated drinking water at 6 times the cost?

Roger Hall

There are many of us that question why the Chief's investigation of the asbestos contamination has not been completed. Everyone on the island except our police department knows it was Quality Enterprises.

Many people believe that it is either corruption or incompetence. Neither of these qualification will meet his next employer's standards. I hope he has a rational explanation to disprove these allegations. I for one would like to hear it.

Roger Hall

Mr. Issler, You can simply go to this link to validate my assertion that it was sewer leaks that closed down the beaches of Sanabel and Captival last fall. http://www.naplesnews.com/news/2006/s...

I really don't think you are interested in the facts or solving the real problem. This belief will be supported by your response to this information.

Roger Hall

Correction: Line 5 should read "mix raw water with reuse water and we don't use anymore water we use less because we have an outlet for the millions of gallons of potable water we send down our injection well." If we aren't sending millions of gallons of potable water down that well why are we spending millions drilling a new one?

Sorry I signed my name twice.

I echo the call for a poll on the STRP.

Thank you Eagle and Ed Bania for an excellent investigative article. It now appears that the whole STRP was and is based on a criminal enterprise and the actions of the council and CM rendered the subsequent approvals invalid. I hope the existing council has enough integrity to put a stop to this $135,000,000 unlawfully promoted program and review the entire matter. If they fail to meet their obligations I am sure there are many citizens that will do their job for them. It is time for this council to start representing the citizens without the citizens having to go to court to force them to do so. May we have some leadership please? Roger Hall

The beatings will continue until moral improves! I guess this is part of the new civility campaign. Eliminate all those who will disagree with you and everybody will be happy. Why would anybody have to think about the moral implications of removing someone from government just because they are exercising their democratic rights? If you want civility, lead by example. Roger Hall